From: Allen on
C J Campbell wrote:
> On 2009-09-18 00:46:40 -0700, Bob Larter <bobbylarter(a)gmail.com> said:
>
>> C J Campbell wrote:
>>> And no -- bureaucratizing health care is unlikely to get rid of waste
>>> and corruption. Far to the contrary. A national health care plan
>>> would vastly increase waste and corruption.
>>
>> Really? In every other country with 'socialised' health care, they
>> spend much less than the USA does.
>
> They also ration their health care. If we included all the patients from
> countries with socialized health care who come to the US for care as
> part of the cost of their care, and subtracted it from what we spend, I
> think the numbers would be dramatically reversed.
Interesting! I didn't realize that Hotmail service was available in
Cloudcuckooland. Oh, and goodbye, Campbell; I don't know how you have
stayed out of my killfile so long. But situation rectified as of right now.
Allen
From: C J Campbell on
On 2009-09-18 10:18:35 -0700, rfischer(a)sonic.net (Ray Fischer) said:

> C J Campbell <christophercampbellremovethis(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
>> On 2009-09-18 00:46:40 -0700, Bob Larter <bobbylarter(a)gmail.com> said:
>>
>>> C J Campbell wrote:
>>>> And no -- bureaucratizing health care is unlikely to get rid of waste
>>>> and corruption. Far to the contrary. A national health care plan would
>>>> vastly increase waste and corruption.
>>>
>>> Really? In every other country with 'socialised' health care, they
>>> spend much less than the USA does.
>>
>> They also ration their health care.
>
> As does the United States.
>
>> If we included all the patients
>> from countries with socialized health care who come to the US for care
>
> Rightard propaganda.

Leftard mindlessness.

--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

From: C J Campbell on
On 2009-09-18 13:28:23 -0700, Allen <allent(a)austin.rr.com> said:

> C J Campbell wrote:
>> On 2009-09-18 00:46:40 -0700, Bob Larter <bobbylarter(a)gmail.com> said:
>>
>>> C J Campbell wrote:
>>>> And no -- bureaucratizing health care is unlikely to get rid of waste
>>>> and corruption. Far to the contrary. A national health care plan would
>>>> vastly increase waste and corruption.
>>>
>>> Really? In every other country with 'socialised' health care, they
>>> spend much less than the USA does.
>>
>> They also ration their health care. If we included all the patients
>> from countries with socialized health care who come to the US for care
>> as part of the cost of their care, and subtracted it from what we
>> spend, I think the numbers would be dramatically reversed.
> Interesting! I didn't realize that Hotmail service was available in
> Cloudcuckooland. Oh, and goodbye, Campbell; I don't know how you have
> stayed out of my killfile so long. But situation rectified as of right
> now.
> Allen

Nutcase. Apparently he can't stand to have people disagree with him. So
he just runs around yelling "Not listening! Not listening!"

--
Waddling Eagle
World Famous Flight Instructor

From: stephe_k on
mikey4 wrote:

>
> People are pissed because "they" have finely woke up to the fact that the
> "government" is out of control and has been for a very long time.

Well I was pissed watching GWB spending BILLIONS on a war while giving
MASSIVE tax breaks to the wealthy. I was pissed watching him do NOTHING
other than watching the economy fail. Were you? Some of us didn't just
"wake up" because a republican wasn't in the white house. If Obama had
been handed a healthy country and done this, I'd be pissed right there
with ya, but that isn't what happened.

Stephanie
From: mikey4 on

"John A." <john(a)nowhere.invalid> wrote in message
news:d758b5dm80vb36oimvad9qnc109sb54giq(a)4ax.com...
> On Fri, 18 Sep 2009 13:17:28 -0500, "mikey4" <lakediver(a)dd..net>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"SMS" <scharf.steven(a)geemail.com> wrote in message
>>news:4ab39e49$0$1662$742ec2ed(a)news.sonic.net...
>>> mikey4 wrote:
>>>
>>>> Just what do you think is happening right now????????? Why do you think
>>>> people are so PISSED????????
>>>
>>> You have a very small number of people that are "PISSED" and they are
>>> pissed because their handlers tell them to be pissed, not because they
>>> have even the slightest understanding of what's going on. They aren't
>>> out
>>> there reading The Economist to gain an in-depth understanding of the
>>> complex issues, they're listening to lies from Glenn Beck, Sean Hannity,
>>> Rush, and the Heritage Foundation. They have no capacity or desire to
>>> even
>>> try to learn. Such is the state of the right-wing.
>>>
>>> The rest of the population may not be too happy about the bailouts but
>>> they have developed the critical thinking skills to understand why the
>>> government could not let companies like AIG fail, why the major banks
>>> could not be allowed to fail, and why manufacturers with billions of
>>> dollars of pension liabilities were better bailed out than allowed to
>>> fail. Yes, it's not fair. The alternative would have been far worse.
>>>
>>> No one blames Obama for this mess. They may put too much of the blame on
>>> George W. Bush since the political philosophy that led us down this road
>>> was began by Ronald Reagan, who has near god-like status among the right
>>> wing, and cannot be blamed for anything.
>>
>>People are pissed because "they" have finely woke up to the fact that the
>>"government" is out of control and has been for a very long time. Problem
>>is we have no idea what would have happened if any of these those
>>companies
>>would have been allowed to fail, only best guesses. AIG spun off their
>>auto
>>insurance company which Farmers has picked up. Yes *I know* that's only
>>one
>>example, my point is that with the mad rush we will never know how many
>>other example there could have been.
>
> I'm a little fuzzy on the details, but my impression was that the
> Great Depression is what happened last time the big banks and
> companies were allowed to fail.
>
Banks were not allowed to fail, from
http://americanhistory.about.com/od/greatdepression/tp/greatdepression.htm
Throughout the 1930s over 9,000 banks failed. Bank deposits were uninsured
and thus as banks failed people simply lost their savings. Surviving banks,
unsure of the economic situation and concerned for their own survival,
stopped being as willing to create new loans. This exacerbated the situation
leading to less and less expenditures.
Sorry to post the link, there are a few here who can't look up the
information themselves.

Also: Many believe erroneously that the stock market crash that occurred on
Black Tuesday, October 29, 1929 is one and the same with the Great
Depression. In fact, it was one of the major causes that led to the Great
Depression. Two months after the original crash in October, stockholders had
lost more than $40 billion dollars. Even though the stock market began to
regain some of its losses, by the end of 1930, it just was not enough and
America truly entered what is called the Great Depression.

And: With the stock market crash and the fears of further economic woes,
individuals from all classes stopped purchasing items. This then led to a
reduction in the number of items produced and thus a reduction in the
workforce. As people lost their jobs, they were unable to keep up with
paying for items they had bought through installment plans and their items
were repossessed. More and more inventory began to accumulate. The
unemployment rate rose above 25% which meant, of course, even less spending
to help alleviate the economic situation.


The list goes on a little further. FDIC now insures deposits in banks and
another insurance company insures stock transactions. There are enough safe
guards in place that another "Great Depression" is unlikely. Of the many
problems we face is that our economy has gone from a primarily manufacturing
one to a consumer based economy.
Then we have the high unemployment rates along with our F'd up government
throwing *more* money at the problems which will most likely cause some
hellish inflation, remember high inflation rates of the 70's?

What's so funny is that it is the government (*both houses*) that create
these problems.

This is a clip from an email I received the other day.
Do not let these 545 people shift the blame to bureaucrats, whom they hire
and whose jobs they can abolish; to lobbyists, whose gifts and advice they
can reject; to regulators, to whom they give the power to regulate and from
whom they can take this power. Above all, do not let them con you into
the belief that there exists disembodied mystical forces like "the
economy," "inflation," or "politics" that prevent them from doing what they
take an oath to do.