From: Savageduck on
On 2009-11-14 17:01:56 -0800, "Bill Graham" <weg9(a)comcast.net> said:

>
> "George Kerby" <ghost_topper(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:C724AB44.3856A%ghost_topper(a)hotmail.com...
>>
>>
>>
>> On 11/14/09 9:03 AM, in article
>> 8LudnUMIR_9IW2PXnZ2dnUVZ_ridnZ2d(a)giganews.com, "Neil Harrington"
>> <secret(a)illumnati.net> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> "Savageduck" <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote in message
>>> news:2009111401130782327-savageduck1(a)REMOVESPAMmecom...
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> It seems we left our history far behind. Have you ever noticed where the
>>>> good old Wells Fargo stage coach driver sat, ...on the right, shotgun on
>>>> the left.
>>>
>>> Apparently that was the standard arrangement for all horse and buggy drivers
>>> too. (Going by the movies, anyway.)
>>>
>>> And it's still the standard position for whoever's steering a power boat.
>
> Did the Indians frequently attack power boats?

Only in the Spring.


--
Regards,

Savageduck

From: Savageduck on
On 2009-11-14 18:22:45 -0800, Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> said:

> On 2009-11-14 16:44:39 -0800, "Bill Graham" <weg9(a)comcast.net> said:
>
>>
>> "Savageduck" <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote in message
>> news:2009111406385244303-savageduck1(a)REMOVESPAMmecom...
>>> On 2009-11-14 04:27:19 -0800, "Wilba" <usenet(a)CUTTHISimago.com.au> said:
>>>
>>>> Savageduck wrote:
>>>>> Savageduck said:
>>>>>> Wilba said:
>>>>>>> Savageduck wrote:
>>>>>>>> Wilba said:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Years ago I read that left-hand drive is safer overall, because when a
>>>>>>>>> person is startled they tend to raise their non-dominant hand to
>>>>>>>>> protect
>>>>>>>>> their head. If at the time they are steering a car on the left of the
>>>>>>>>> road, 9 out of 10 will therefore sverve into oncoming traffic.
>>>>>>>>> Apparently the effect is statistically significant.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It seems we left our history far behind. Have you ever noticed where
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> good old Wells Fargo stage coach driver sat, ...on the right, shotgun
>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> the left.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Don't see many of them 'round these here parts. :- )
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Note the driver on the left.
>>>>>> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/41/Concord_stagecoach_1869.png
>>>>>
>>>>> Sorry, that was the right, the shot gun was on the left.
>>>>> Now I don't know my left from my right!
>>>>
>>>> I worked that out. :- )
>>>>
>>>> I wonder why they did it that way, since the driver is on the ejector
>>>> side...? Maybe the convention pre-dates the widespread use of repeating
>>>> rifles.
>>>
>>> I think it was a case of right handed shotgun shooters out numbering
>>> left handed shooters. That way they wouldn't have to replace a driver
>>> every time a left handed guard blew the driver away. Maybe a
>>> qualification for shotgun guards was to be right handed.
>>>
>>> Maybe there was a rule of the road that stagecoach robbers had a "rob
>>> from left side" only sense of etiquette. ;-)
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Savageduck
>>>
>> Maybe it had something to do with which side the shells were ejected
>> from when the rifle action was worked....It would be very annoying to
>> the driver if the hot shell casings were ejected into his face while he
>> was trying to get away from the bad guys.....
>
> A left handed shotgun guard would be pointing his shotgun at the driver
> on the left, when sitting on the right side, instead of pointing it
> safely off to the right.
> In any sort of a fight who cares where the empty cases go?

....er that was meant to be the driver sitting on the right, shot gun on
the left.
I sure wouldn't want to drive a stagecoach with a loaded shotgun
pointed at me over those trails.


--
Regards,

Savageduck

From: Bill Graham on

"Wilba" <usenet(a)CUTTHISimago.com.au> wrote in message
news:0088e021$0$26848$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com...
> R. Mark Clayton wrote:
>>
>> Japanese by contrast has an immensely complex verbal structure,
>
> Hmm, "immensely complex verbal structure" is the exact opposite of my
> experience with Japanese. I can explain everything you need to know about
> Japanese pronounciation in 5 minutes. As long as we're not talking about
> kanji, if you can see a word written you can pronounce it well, and if you
> hear a word clearly you can write it correctly, because of the simple
> phonemic structure.
>
>> ... three scripts and numerous other convolutions that mean Japanese
>> children do well to be fully conversant by the time they leave school
>> and foreigners have negligible chance of becoming conversant even
>> after living a year in the country.
>
> I guess you're talking about kanji, plus having three other mutually
> exclusive ways of writing, but the spoken language itself is very simple
> compared to English.
>
When I was in the Navy, I bought a book titled, "Japanese in 40 lessons". I
went through 20 of the lessons before we got to Japan, and I was able to
converse with the natives reasonably well during the three cruises we made
to Japan in three years. It had a very simple grammatical structure, where
the two letter endings on each word identified their grammatical place in
the sentence.....Endings like, "wa", and "go" tacked onto the ends of each
word. The pronunciation was very simple, and the Japanese had no trouble
understanding me.

From: Bill Graham on

"Wilba" <usenet(a)CUTTHISimago.com.au> wrote in message
news:0088e3f0$0$26898$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com...
> Bill Graham wrote:
>> Wilba wrote:
>>> Bill Graham wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Maybe it had something to do with which side the shells were ejected
>>>> from when the rifle action was worked....It would be very annoying to
>>>> the driver if the hot shell casings were ejected into his face while he
>>>> was trying to get away from the bad guys.....
>>>
>>> But in that photo the driver is on the ejector side.
>>
>> I don't know how you can tell....different rifles eject the shells to
>> different sides.....As I remember, the M1 (used by US soldiers in WW-II,
>> ejected the shells to the right, but I have seen other guns that ejected
>> them to the left side....
>
> As a general rule firearms are designed to eject on the opposite side from
> most shooter's faces. In all my years of civilian and military shooting, I
> don't recall any left-side ejection weapons - not saying they don't exist,
> just that they aren't common enough for me to remember ever seeing any.
>
> Anyway, it doesn't matter since it seems they mostly used shotguns, and
> the driver sat on the right where the brake lever was.
>
Yes. In those days, they didn't have automatic shotguns, so there was no
ejection until you opened the action.....

From: Bill Graham on

"Savageduck" <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote in message
news:2009111418332743658-savageduck1(a)REMOVESPAMmecom...
> On 2009-11-14 17:01:38 -0800, "Wilba" <usenet(a)CUTTHISimago.com.au> said:
>
>> Savageduck wrote:
>>> Wilba said:
>>>> Savageduck wrote:
>>>>> Savageduck said:
>>>>>> Wilba said:
>>>>>>> Savageduck wrote:
>>>>>>>> Wilba said:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Years ago I read that left-hand drive is safer overall, because
>>>>>>>>> when
>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>> person is startled they tend to raise their non-dominant hand to
>>>>>>>>> protect
>>>>>>>>> their head. If at the time they are steering a car on the left of
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> road, 9 out of 10 will therefore sverve into oncoming traffic.
>>>>>>>>> Apparently the effect is statistically significant.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It seems we left our history far behind. Have you ever noticed
>>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> good old Wells Fargo stage coach driver sat, ...on the right,
>>>>>>>> shotgun
>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> the left.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Don't see many of them 'round these here parts. :- )
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Note the driver on the left.
>>>>>> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/41/Concord_stagecoach_1869.png
>>>>>
>>>>> Sorry, that was the right, the shot gun was on the left.
>>>>> Now I don't know my left from my right!
>>>>
>>>> I worked that out. :- )
>>>>
>>>> I wonder why they did it that way, since the driver is on the ejector
>>>> side...? Maybe the convention pre-dates the widespread use of repeating
>>>> rifles.
>>>
>>> I think it was a case of right handed shotgun shooters out numbering
>>> left
>>> handed shooters. That way they wouldn't have to replace a driver every
>>> time a left handed guard blew the driver away. Maybe a qualification for
>>> shotgun guards was to be right handed.
>>>
>>> Maybe there was a rule of the road that stagecoach robbers had a "rob
>>> from
>>> left side" only sense of etiquette. ;-)
>>
>> As so many things do, I bet if you dug deep enough you could trace it
>> back
>> to ancient Rome, and chariots. :- )
>
> Probably even further back to Persian charioteers, driver and archer
> teams.
>
Yes. A right handed archer's right elbow might be interfered with if he sat
to the chariot driver's left, so this might have something to do with his
sitting on the right.